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Post by Barry Moore on Jul 24, 2019 9:31:01 GMT
Hello,
i was thinking of getting an usb audio interface and a combo amp and swap out the speaker from the combo amp with a FRFR speaker like the Celestion F12-X200, but then i was told that it wont work well. I dont like the look of standard FRFR speaker boxes and the guitar cab looking FRFR cabs are very pricey.
Is there a "budget" option for this? Are there any combo amps that would be good with a speaker like this and pc amp sims?
If not, what would i need for it to work properly? I guess i would need a power amp?
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1,773 posts
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Post by MartinB on Jul 24, 2019 20:27:13 GMT
I’m a bit confused why you want a combo with the pc setup. When I use my pc setup I just use my pc speakers. I have a separate valve combo if I want that.
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3,968 posts
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Post by salteedog on Jul 24, 2019 21:15:14 GMT
I've used the following (not for stage but for home practice).
Interface -> Home Stereo System Interface -> Keyboard amp Interface -> Digital modelling amp (Boss Katana) - the 'acoustic' setting has a very flat response.
Modelling amps in general will have speakers with a wider range.
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Post by JAC on Jul 25, 2019 20:20:40 GMT
My (bass) set up for a long time was bass>interface>DSP>PA amp>PA sub + cab. I also used the same set up for practice, just swapping the pa part for studio monitors. What you say about swapping out the speaker on a combo doesn't work well because a large part of a speakers sound comes from the design of the enclosure. I would say that the budget option would be to get whatever FRFR speaker you like the sound of and maybe build a fake guitar cab around it to hide it. (BTW, I hate that FRFR term, it basically stands for "speaker that sounds like it should" )
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ben
Harley Benton Club Junior Member
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Post by ben on Jul 29, 2019 20:27:28 GMT
Hey, didnt log in the last time.. Im Barry Yeah, i ditched the idea and did some research... Now im thinking of getting this audio interface: www.thomann.de/gb/behringer_umc404hd.htmand this pa speaker: www.thomann.de/de/behringer_b112w.htmand i would use the PC amp sims like bias fx... Like the 4 inputs on the AI. For now, it's just me with my electric guitar and my gf with her bass, but it's good to have for the future... Also has MIDI, which i could use for some foot controller down the road. Probably the cheap behringer model.. Reviews for the AI and the PA speaker are very good. Dont really know what to expect, but i like the idea of having just one speaker so me and my girlfriend can use it simultaneously.. The only big dilemma right now is if i should go for an active pa speaker with DSP? Saw some explanations about it, but dont really know if it would be important for us... Any thoughts on DSP that could help me decide? Really appreciate your input!!
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Post by JAC on Jul 30, 2019 12:32:27 GMT
Hi Barry / Ben Regarding DSP, the real use for DSP is to process the signal you are sending (EQ, Delay, Frequencies etc.) to a specific amplifier channel or, in this case, powered speaker. As you are planning on using only one speaker, you have no use for delays, levels, frequency filtering (sending lows to a sub, mids to the mids etc.) or literally anything else that a DSP will provide you, except for equalisation. As you will be running this from a PC, all equalisation can be done directly in the software you are using. Therefore, unless you plan on adding more parts to the system then there is no point is spending extra on the DSP (even if you were running to speakers in stereo you would still not need DSP). For the interface, I have the UMC204HD and am pretty happy with it, I can't tell you if the 404 is exactly the same internals just with an extra 2 inputs but I guess it will be. The thing that you need to take into consideration when using multiple inputs simultaneously is the power of the PC you are using. Each extra input being used at the same time will need more processing power on the PC, especially as you start to use effects, simulations and other things inside your software. I can't say if you will run into issues or not as I do not have your PC, the AI or know what software an effects you will be using. As you increase the need for processing power, depending on your machine, you may need to start increasing latency to avoid glitches. How much you will need to increase this by and whether this bothers you when playing is something I can't answer. Some people are quickly irritated by a very small latency and others are not so bothered. It is possible to set your output to be a direct monitor of your input, which will reduce latency to practically zero, however, then the effects and simulations you use will not be heard through the output as you are simply monitoring your input. Sorry but I can't comment on the speaker as I haven't heard it, as far as I can remember.
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ben
Harley Benton Club Junior Member
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Post by ben on Aug 1, 2019 9:03:21 GMT
Was thinking of just getting one speaker, but now im thinking of getting this pair with stands, a bundle deal: www.thomann.de/gb/the_box_pa_12_dsp_bundle.htmThey are reviewed very well. Have dsp, which could come in handy down the line, if we add a sub... The price for the bundle is about the same as 2 speakers, so the 2 stands are basically free. Any experience with these speakers? Would they be good for an electric guitar? Have a lenovo laptop with these specs: CPU Type Mobile DualCore Intel Core i3-3110M, 2400 MHz (24 x 100) System Memory 8096 MB (DDR3-1600 DDR3 SDRAM) Video Adapter NVIDIA GeForce GT 635M (2 GB) Audio Adapter Conexant Cx20590 @ Intel Panther Point PCH - High Definition Audio Controller [C-1] Audio Adapter Intel Panther Point HDMI @ Intel Panther Point PCH - High Definition Audio Controller [C-1] Disk Drive Samsung SSD 850 EVO 250GB (232 GB) Would this be strong enough for some standard amp sim that is not very demanding, for a guitar and bass? Oh, would maybe prefer these speakers: www.thomann.de/gb/the_box_pro_dsp_112.htmPurely for the looks. Like the full front grill type of look, but in the reviews i saw that people complaint that the grill is making noises sometimes. Is this an old problem that was resolved or is this still an active problem?
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ben
Harley Benton Club Junior Member
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Post by ben on Aug 1, 2019 13:44:05 GMT
Oh, no. Not for a long while.. We just started to learn guitar and bass but both of us have the desire and the will to learn.. Have no set goals, but would be nice to play live for an audience at one point.. Maybe 5 years from now, who knows Checked bias fx 2 and amplitube system requirements. My laptop is above the recommended req., but dont know how would two instruments affect the performance.. Will probably get the AI first and test the whole thing out with our headphones. Saw a review of the behringer 404 AI and the guy said that the headphone output is very strong compared to his old AI, so i hope i could just get a splitter cable and use 2 HP's simultaneously. If not, i would buy a HP amplifier.
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ben
Harley Benton Club Junior Member
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Post by ben on Aug 1, 2019 16:01:23 GMT
Was looking at some studio monitors, but they are usually 3-8" and cost around the same or more as these 12-15". I read that the pa speakers sound good also at low volumes. Is that really so? We live in a house, so not a big issue to crank it up a bit..
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Post by JAC on Aug 1, 2019 16:31:19 GMT
I haven't used The Box speakers for a long time, I did have a full PA system by them at one point, and I do know various people with them, however, I can't say I have heard those exact models (at least as far as I can remember). What I found with The Box speakers was that they can sound a little muffled in comparison to other brands, but the other brands I am comparing them to are at least 10 times the price, so the comparison is not fair. I found the PA system I had by them great for setting up for parties etc. where I didn't want to spend the whole night watching the speakers to make sure they weren't abused. I will say that they are pretty darn tough. If the metal grille causes rattling, this is easily solved with some small rubber washers. The DSP112 model only says that it has "Built-in DSP with 4 presets and low cut" but I am guessing that you can custom EQ it and set the low cut to whatever frequency you prefer and it will also output (through the output XLR) a signal with the highs cut (to go to a sub). If it doesn't do these things then I would skip it completely. I do agree with DefJef about the size and power of these though. The are pretty loud and I think you will find that they are rather excessive for indoor use, except for maybe a party now and again, but that depends on how loud you like your music and how quickly you are prepared to lose your hearing My current bass rig is a Rumble 500 (500W) and I can´t go above 15% without things starting to vibrate and fall off shelves For home practice I use a single JBL LSR305 which is plenty for what I need, but if you need louder, a pair of 8" monitors will be plenty, at least in my opinion. For your PC, I can't say how well it will run, you will have to test that out yourself and see. My PC is running an i7 with 16GB of RAM and I can get it to stutter sometimes if I go a little crazy with effects and delays in Ableton, but again, each software and PC may behave differently. The headphone output of the UMC204HD (which I am guessing is the same as the 404HD) starts getting rather dirty and distorted once you get it above 50% and it will respond differently to whatever load you put on it. In other words, depending on how difficult to drive the headphones are, and their impedance, it may give you enough volume to run both of them under 50% or it may not. The sensitivity of the headphones will also impact whether you hear the distortion or not in the signal. Running the 204 into my Audio Technica M40X gives me plenty of volume without getting to the point of distortion, however, if I try to run my Beyerdynamic DT1990 or Sennheiser HD650 then there is no chance of me getting to decent levels without distortion. Again, each headphone will be completely different in this regard. Unfortunately the only way to know the correct answers to this is by either trying it or finding someone with that exact same set up. The good thing is that Thomanns return policy is very good!
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ben
Harley Benton Club Junior Member
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Post by ben on Aug 1, 2019 17:05:48 GMT
Ok, thanks for the info. Will have to think about all this, so i just wont get into buying anything till im sure. Just the AI for now. The thing is i always see posts how the electric guitar sounds bad through anything under 12", but not sure if that is also true for PA speakers or only guitar cabs? Any thoughts on how would an 8" pa speaker sound with an electric guitar? Wouldnt mind getting a pair of 8" speakers if they sound good... Wanted to get an AI with 2 headphone outputs, but the cheapest that i could find that had everything i need was around 185€, so instead i would just get this HP amp with 4 outputs: www.thomann.de/gb/behringer_ha400.htm That is of course if we wouldnt be happy with the splitter method. We have a pair of these: www.thomann.de/gb/superlux_hd681_b.htm and quite happy with them... I'll probably just go to some music shop and test things out. This is very difficult to figure out online Thanks a lot for all the good info!! I really appreciate it..
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