kptz
Harley Benton Club Junior Member
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Post by kptz on Apr 28, 2018 22:03:20 GMT
Hello guys, first post here. I'd like your opinion on a few guitars I currently have in mind. Long version:To put things in prespective, I'm the type of guy that rarely plays a guitar out of the box and when I do its usually only to check if the eletronics work. I already own 2 bentons, a fanfret and a bass. The bass was bought new, had many flaws but i loved the sound so decided to fix and keep it. The fanfret I bought recently on the decor section and other than razor sharp frets, the guitar was flawless. Put some EMGs 707 on that one. Beautiful guitar. Cutting it short, I like to setup my guitars exactly to my liking, I always replace the pickups and I'm ok with doing some fretwork or other types of jobs (as long as drilling and routing isn't involved) and I kind of love that process as part of the fun of getting a new guitar. I looked around the forum and youtube and everyone seems to focus on the "out of the box" aspect of the HB and as mentioned above, that is really not something I care about. I also dont care (much) about the looks. Neither about the sound since the pickups will, 99% sure, be coming out of the guitar. So, what do I care about in a guitar? I like my guitars well built and with good woods since you can't replace those usually and poor woods tend to age poorly. Also playability and feel play a huge factor in it. I love skinny flat necks (think ibanez original wizard) I'v been having the GAS lately for a full mahogany guitar. My current options are: CST 24 BK www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_cst_24_bk.htmCST 24T BF www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_cst_24t_black_flame.htmSC Custom www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_sc_custom_lemon_flame.htmSC 450+ LD www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_sc_450plus_ld_vintage_series.htmSC 550 TB www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_sc_550_faded_tobacco_flame.htmThey are pretty much by the order I'm currently considering them, with the CST24T and the Custom being at tie for second place. Note that the tremolo on the CST24T probably wont see much use as I got floyd rose guitars for that purpose. So, what do you guys have to say about these guitars construction wise? What about the woods? If you have had them for a while now, how are the necks holding out? Also something I am very curious about, is the CST 24 any different than the CST 24T construction/material wise? Expecially the black one since it's the cheapest by a considerable amount. Also curious about the SC's, expecially the first 2. The SC550 I figure I'd be better off with a used epiphone std? Maybe not, let me hear out your oppinions on it aswell. TLDR (too long, didn't read): What is the best full mahogany guitar HB has to offer construction/material(wood) wise if pickups, looks and out of the box playability are not a factor? Thanks in advance and sorry for the huge post
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Post by tarn on Apr 29, 2018 6:42:58 GMT
First of all welcome. Second; damn what a first post. Third; well you should care about the first impression out of the box, it says a lot about how the manufacturer sees there customers. At the moment the quality control at thomann is pretty much non existent. They basically admitted on video that they knew that part of there wilkinson pickups where fakes all this time, but yet still sold them. forth; its simple, if you live in Europe buy one If you like it keep it, if you don't return it. It will be a hit or miss anyway. but if you can spend a little more, go for brands as esp, revelation, vintage,...... These are brands where quality control still matters. note: i don't endorse or get endors't by any of these brands
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Post by Deleted on Apr 29, 2018 8:49:44 GMT
My SC-550 Amber was perfect! Slim tapper neck, starts as C and then at the 5th fret goes into a more modern D shape. very easy to play. The 450+ is more of a vintage C shape if you like a bit thicker necks. All Les Paul guitars seem heavy! They are very resonant and sustain well! Never had a CST. Never had an Epi either. Welcome to the Club!
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kptz
Harley Benton Club Junior Member
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Post by kptz on Apr 29, 2018 12:22:49 GMT
Thank you for your feedback. tarn I tried to give as much info as possible on what I was looking for so that the answers could be as accurate as possible. But yeah, that was quite a wall of text. I understand what you mean by buying one and just returning if I don't like, but I kind of don't want to do that with 5 guitars just to compare them.. Also, some of my questions about the wood quality kind of require you to have one of those guitars for a few months now to be able to answer (like neck stability). About those other brands you mentioned, I could probably pickup one of those second hand for about the same as a SC-550 new. You think those would be better deals? Again, construction/wood wise. I'm asking because I was under the impression that a 550 was, pretty much, a Vintage V100 in disguise? @che People seem to speak wonders about that 550, same with the CST24T. Expecially sustain-wise! Regarding necks I prefer them on the skinny side with flat radius if possible. I also just stumbled upon the SC-1000. How is it different than the SC-Custom?
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Post by Banana on Apr 30, 2018 8:17:43 GMT
There are definite similarities between 550 and V100, but short conclusion would be that Vintage is more.. vintage ( ), while 550 is bit more modern. Regarding your question, CST-24 in black (hardtail version with no flame maple veneer) has thicker neck than the version with trem (not sure about Black Flame). It is thick and wide (that's whats he said , but pretty flat. Think aobut it as PRS SE wide thick profile in D shape. Body construction and materials is pretty much the same, excluding maple veneer. Trem version is joy to play and it has added benefit of adjustable radius bridge. It always bugs me when the radius on wraparound bridge does not match the radius of fretboard. Thomann site says that CST-24/T has 350 mm radius (13.7"), wraparound bridge has 12" radius. ALthough my black CST-24 and the trem version I had before felt more like 16" radius
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700 posts
YouTube Channel: ToroK Channel
Disclosures: See Signature
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Post by taurash on Apr 30, 2018 10:28:02 GMT
Hi kptzI haven't tried all the guitars you quote, so I will only give you my opinions about the CST24T and the SC custom. The CST24 is a bit lighter than the SC custom, sounds good when unplugged but sustain is not as good as on the Sc custom. In terms of playability, I have to mention that the CST24T was under the Sc custom, but it may be due to the trem. About that trem, if you buy this guitar, you have to know that the trem bar cannot be fixed. So if you lean forward, this bloody bar will fall down ! It's one of the reasons why I didn't keep that guitar. The Sc custom is my favorite. The neck is pure happiness, you don't feel tired with it even after playing for 8 hours. The radius is 350mm if I remember, makes it quite easy playing all type of chords and the profile of the neck is fine for fast leads also. Only one thing to keep in mind about the SC custom : it's heavy. The neck is a bit too light so if you play sitting, you need to weigh the head up. If you play standing, no problem
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3,968 posts
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Post by salteedog on Apr 30, 2018 12:00:55 GMT
Isn't there a little (practically hidden) screw for that trem bar? I thought I saw it discussed on this forum before.
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kptz
Harley Benton Club Junior Member
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Post by kptz on Apr 30, 2018 12:19:09 GMT
Cheers guys, lots of useful info! Banana Do HB's miss much on the radius specs? I hadn't considered yet that the radius could be different than what's on the spec sheet. If that's the case, I can definitely see the advantage of getting the trem version. Even if i don't care for the flame veneer. So, CST24-BK scrapped from the list ^^ And those 16" radius would be right around my ballpark. My Ibanez is 430mm (17" i think) and my HB fanfret says it's 400mm (almost 16"), both feel great to play even if the HB's is a bit wider (1 extra string) and thicker. Regarding the Vintage, do you think they both (v100 and sc550) compare in overall build and wood quality? If you get a good one, i mean. Because if they don't, that's another one that's probably coming off the list. Update: Seems the V100 has a short tenon, so maybe they are not as similar as i thought (as both are made in Vietnam). taurash I'v been a video from EytschPi42 where he going on a ramble about that trem. It seems you can in fact lock the trem arm, but its not exactly straightforward. EDIT: As salteedog mentioned Sad to hear you didn't keep it tho, especially if that was it's only "flaw". But seeing how happy you are with your Custom, maybe it was for the better! How do you feel the necks compare between those two? Similar radius? Similar thickness?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 30, 2018 12:19:22 GMT
Isn't there a little (practically hidden) screw for that trem bar? I thought I saw it discussed on this forum before. Yes the tiny screw is behind the tremolo bridge many have problems finding it
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700 posts
YouTube Channel: ToroK Channel
Disclosures: See Signature
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Post by taurash on Apr 30, 2018 12:24:03 GMT
Isn't there a little (practically hidden) screw for that trem bar? I thought I saw it discussed on this forum before. Well if there is one, it's really very well hidden
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700 posts
YouTube Channel: ToroK Channel
Disclosures: See Signature
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Post by taurash on Apr 30, 2018 12:36:52 GMT
Cheers guys, lots of useful info! taurash I'v been a video from EytschPi42 where he going on a ramble about that trem. It seems you can in fact lock the trem arm, but its not exactly straightforward. EDIT: As salteedog mentioned Sad to hear you didn't keep it tho, especially if that was it's only "flaw". But seeing how happy you are with your Custom, maybe it was for the better! How do you feel the necks compare between those two? Similar radius? Similar thickness? You're welcome Well, this trem bar was not the only reason why I didn't keep the CST24T. The two other reasons are : - I'm used to playing with a whammy bar. But sometimes, when I feel lazy, I'm bored with the idea to tune a floyd rose guitar up. So, I thought "why not trying a trem bar ?" But the effects I'm using are way harder to play with a trem. On a floyd rose, I just push very slightly. On this trem bar, I almost felt like doing a bodybuiling exercise for my fingers ! - The sound of the pups is absolutely not for me. Too close from PRS, absolutely not my kind. I could have changed them, but before spending 60€ for new pups (dragonfire Phat screamers), I want to make sure that everything else is fine. And there it was not. I had the SC Custom before the CST24T. But sending back the CST24T allowed me buying a ESP LTD MH100 which I already love About the necks, there are very few differences between CST and SC custom. I had the feeling - and that's just a feeling - that the CST24T's neck was a little bit thicker than the SC custom's. The radius is the same, 350mm, very easy playing. I forgot a small detail : the fret polish work was better on the Sc custom than on the CST24T, but It seems it's a kind of X-factor on HBs
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kptz
Harley Benton Club Junior Member
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Post by kptz on Apr 30, 2018 14:07:22 GMT
That LTD seems lovely, never seen a belly cut like that. It looks very comfortable for standing up playing. Banana do you think the SC-Custom could suffer from the same problem as the CST24 regarding the bridge and fretboard radius? I have narrowed the list quite a bit by now. I was digging the CST24 BK with its wooden binding and plain looks. With that out of the equation, I decided to also rule out the CST24T. Also according to @chedapapa blackwood (pine) should probably be avoided like the plague, which also rules out a few models. This is how the list looks at the moment: - SC-Custom Lemon or Blue Flame (any ideas on why the difference in prices?) - SC-550 or a used epi/v100 for the same price I'm really interested in the quality difference between the SC-550 and both the Epi Std and the v100, since it seems to be the guitars it's kind of competing against. Especially regarding woods (I'v read some horror stories about epiphone). And again, I'm ok with doing some fret work and the pickups would be coming of on either of the guitars (jazz and JB going in probably, as i got a set laying around), just interested in wood and overall quality as a potential modding platform. Maybe someone got one of this guitars and can chime in?
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thunderbird
Harley Benton Expert
Less purchase, more practice
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Post by thunderbird on May 2, 2018 2:42:35 GMT
Thank you for your feedback. Also, some of my questions about the wood quality kind of require you to have one of those guitars for a few months now to be able to answer (like neck stability). Welcome to the forum kptz Late to the party here, but I have both the 550 (over 2yrs owned) and 450+ (nearly 2yrs owned). Necks are super stable.
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Post by Banana on May 2, 2018 6:50:28 GMT
That LTD seems lovely, never seen a belly cut like that. It looks very comfortable for standing up playing. Banana do you think the SC-Custom could suffer from the same problem as the CST24 regarding the bridge and fretboard radius? Good question! If I remember right, most of TOM bridges have 12" radius, so there will most likely be a slight mis-match. However, filing the slots on TOM bridge is easier than doing so on the wraparound bridge, so it should be a less of hassle to solve it, assuming that it is noticeable? Regarding the trem on CST-24T, it requires a set up to your personal preferences. If I remember right (again), it comes with 3 springs, so if it requires lot of force to use, you can take off one spring.
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2018 6:51:53 GMT
Thank you for your feedback. Also, some of my questions about the wood quality kind of require you to have one of those guitars for a few months now to be able to answer (like neck stability). Welcome to the forum kptz Late to the party here, but I have both the 550 (over 2yrs owned) and 450+ (nearly 2yrs owned). Necks are super stable. Do you have the Rosewood version? Or the new Blackwood and Roseacer? Wonder how these new woods are behaving over longer time.
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