hyke
Harley Benton Club Junior Member
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Post by hyke on Oct 17, 2018 13:30:46 GMT
First of all, hello everyone. I'm looking to substitute my old cheap ST guitar, and Harley Benton might be the best bet for it. I'm looking for a guitar to play from things like AC/DC, Foo Fighters, GnR, to Iron Maiden, Metallica, Black Sabbath... I also play while sitting 95% of the time.
And pretty much narrowed my options down to the SC-Custom/SC550 and the CST 24T. I've been looking at outdated videos mostly, but I can't decide on which model to get.
-I like the CST 24T because its pretty similar to my ST, I know that it works for me, and the trem is something really nice to have. -But also, I've never played a LP style guitar, and I really like the way both the SC-Custom and the SC550 sound and look in the videos I've seen.
I would love to hear some insight from you guys, to try and make up my mind.
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Post by DerAlex on Oct 17, 2018 13:44:11 GMT
I won the SC550 and it is a great guitar - I had a Deco CST24 which was nicely made but with a distorted neck (unplayable). But the CST was high quality build wise as well.
I have no need for a trem so I am very happy with the SC550.
If you need/want a trem I would suggest trying out the CST24T first.
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3,457 posts
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Post by LeoThunder on Oct 17, 2018 14:24:01 GMT
If you play sitting and have been used to a Strat', the Les Paul shape won't be your friend. Everything will be in the wrong place. Here is one reason why: All guitars above are represented at scale and aligned on the inward curve, the point which rests on the leg. The Les Paul and PRS shapes (in this case a SC-550 and a CST24) have a shorter scale and a large, round body which moves their centre of gravity towards the bridge. As a result, the Les Paul will often be unbalanced in sitting position, pulling to the bridge side. This can be quite anoying when playing on a chair or a stool. The PRS shape has the same issue but a thinner body might make for a better balance. When sitting on a flat surface like a couch, the wide belly of the beast rests on it and gives the guitar an angle, with the neck pointing down, unless the player has thick enough thighs. This is common to both Les Paul and PRS. I suppose this also happens with the Jazzmaster and Jaguar. It certainly does with my Jazz bass. To make this all worse, the Les Paul shape has a thicker, angular body which digs into the player's ribs. Not nice. Then there is an angle between the neck and body, which changes the way the whole object feels. You end up playing a triangle instead of a plank: The strings are further away from the player's body. This latter point is not necessarily an inconvenient but it does make for a very noticeable change to a Strat'. Then the shorter scale throws habits away for good measure. I find myself hitting wrong notes all the time when I play one, because I never got used to it. So, in short, both SC and CST will make you feel in a very different place. How much that matters is a personal thing but it will be there. Then of course, the sound will be quite different too. It can be welcome as an addition but not as a replacement.
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1,773 posts
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Post by MartinB on Oct 17, 2018 14:33:06 GMT
Start with a humbucker bridge or a super strat perhaps then?
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3,457 posts
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Post by LeoThunder on Oct 17, 2018 14:56:39 GMT
-But also, I've never played a LP style guitar, and I really like the way both the SC-Custom and the SC550 sound and look in the videos I've seen. The sound you like in the SC-Custom will be given by the DC variant too (the SG copy). It will also have the short scale (628mm) but none of the other idiosyncrasies like the weight, neck angle, the thick, edgy body or the imbalance. Many of the videos on Youtube are older and feature Wilkinson pick-ups. These have been replaced by Roswell in the course of 2017 which sound a little different. I think my SC-450 Plus with Roswell sounds much clearer than the SC-Custom with Wilkinson I once had. But they are still "old fashioned" humbuckers, sounding nothing like my Strat's.
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Post by roberto on Oct 17, 2018 15:45:39 GMT
LeoThunder It's true! I have the SC Custom and for me is very hard to play sitting for the incorrect posture needed. Also the weight of mine SC is terribly ... but it's a Lady for the look and playability (no buzz at all, good sound, good strings action and hardware etc.)
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hyke
Harley Benton Club Junior Member
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Post by hyke on Oct 17, 2018 15:51:55 GMT
If you play sitting and have been used to a Strat', the Les Paul shape won't be your friend. Everything will be in the wrong place. Here is one reason why: All guitars above are represented at scale and aligned on the inward curve, the point which rests on the leg. The Les Paul and PRS shapes (in this case a SC-550 and a CST24) have a shorter scale and a large, round body which moves their centre of gravity towards the bridge. As a result, the Les Paul will often be unbalanced in sitting position, pulling to the bridge side. This can be quite anoying when playing on a chair or a stool. The PRS shape has the same issue but a thinner body might make for a better balance. When sitting on a flat surface like a couch, the wide belly of the beast rests on it and gives the guitar an angle, with the neck pointing down, unless the player has thick enough thighs. This is common to both Les Paul and PRS. I suppose this also happens with the Jazzmaster and Jaguar. It certainly does with my Jazz bass. To make this all worse, the Les Paul shape has a thicker, angular body which digs into the player's ribs. Not nice. Then there is an angle between the neck and body, which changes the way the whole object feels. You end up playing a triangle instead of a plank: The strings are further away from the player's body. This latter point is not necessarily an inconvenient but it does make for a very noticeable change to a Strat'. Then the shorter scale throws habits away for good measure. I find myself hitting wrong notes all the time when I play one, because I never got used to it. So, in short, both SC and CST will make you feel in a very different place. How much that matters is a personal thing but it will be there. Then of course, the sound will be quite different too. It can be welcome as an addition but not as a replacement. Wow, didn't actually thing much about the differences in the resting point of the guitar and the angles and the distance of the strings from the body. Thanks. But I think I'll have to clarify some things about me too. I'm quite a beginner, can play a few songs, but I'm still learning to properly do really basic stuff. And the reason I say this is because, I don't like my strat at all. It's a cheap ass guitar, hate the way it plays with the ****ty sticky glossy neck, with pretty high action due to really poor frets, ground issues, and all that kind of stuff that really kills any interest in playing with the guitar. It's "worked" for me to learn as I've gotten kinda used to it, but I don't think I might like it enough as to get a proper strat before trying out different things that I may (or may not) actually enjoy playing. I don't think it will take long for me to get used to changes, as I've been playing for less than a year, and I'm not that good to begin with, so maybe a few weeks of kinda-struggling while playing don't bother me too much. As for the shapes and ribs, I've read people complaining about it on the SC550 specially, but the CST and SC-Custom, both have belly cut if I'm not mistaken, which should help in that regard? (Please correct me if I'm wrong on anything) I'm also a pretty big and tall guy, so maybe it helps too. EDIT: What I mean with this is that I'm really open to the differences between body shapes, and would really love to try something different.
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hyke
Harley Benton Club Junior Member
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Post by hyke on Oct 17, 2018 15:53:25 GMT
-But also, I've never played a LP style guitar, and I really like the way both the SC-Custom and the SC550 sound and look in the videos I've seen. The sound you like in the SC-Custom will be given by the DC variant too (the SG copy). It will also have the short scale (628mm) but none of the other idiosyncrasies like the weight, neck angle, the thick, edgy body or the imbalance. Many of the videos on Youtube are older and feature Wilkinson pick-ups. These have been replaced by Roswell in the course of 2017 which sound a little different. I think my SC-450 Plus with Roswell sounds much clearer than the SC-Custom with Wilkinson I once had. But they are still "old fashioned" humbuckers, sounding nothing like my Strat's. Thanks so much for the info. I actually had not seen those (Angus Young fanboy here), so I'll check them right now.
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3,457 posts
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Post by LeoThunder on Oct 17, 2018 16:22:01 GMT
It's a cheap ass guitar, hate the way it plays with the ****ty sticky glossy neck, with pretty high action due to really poor frets, ground issues, and all that kind of stuff that really kills any interest in playing with the guitar. … As for the shapes and ribs, I've read people complaining about it on the SC550 specially, but the CST and SC-Custom, both have belly cut if I'm not mistaken, which should help in that regard? (Please correct me if I'm wrong on anything) The rib cut on the SC-Custom solves one problem but not the others. I suppose the CST might not have the neck angle but I don't know. Never held one. I'm not sure body size matters much but if you have large hands, you'll be annoyed at the shorter scale. I know I am, feeling better on my guitars which have an even longer scale than a Strat'. Both SC and DC models have glossy necks. I think the CST too. I don't mind, I like them, but if you don't, now you know. Poor frets can be filed down and ground issues are easily solved. This is really something worth doing on any guitar. You can get a cheap fret file and a cheap soldering iron set on ebay. I had to touch a few frets on each of my Harley Benton, by the way, and not on my other guitars. They are just not quite as good in this respect, but also cheaper. Still, I got the action down to 1.15-1.25mm on my SC-450 Plus, which is a nice result. Whatever you do, get a guitar you really want. It will justify everything.
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3,457 posts
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Post by LeoThunder on Oct 17, 2018 16:41:23 GMT
LeoThunder It's true! I have the SC Custom and for me is very hard to play sitting for the incorrect posture needed. Also the weight of mine SC is terribly ... but it's a Lady for the look and playability (no buzz at all, good sound, good strings action and hardware etc.) Posture has to change for the Les Paul. I can play it sitting on the couch but I hold it at a greater angle, more like a riffle. Chair or stool are not welcome, because of the imbalance. It is never as comfortable as a Strat or an Ibanez. These I can hold at nearly no angle in front of me, unless I'm playing barre chords (the fretting hand needs the angle). I had to adapt to the Jazz Bass too. This one is better played on a chair or the very edge of the couch because I have to hold the neck up for balance (it's a broad 5-string neck with a ridiculously large headstock and a basswood body) which precludes any flat surface beneath the end of the guitar. Both play nicely standing but why should I bother?
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3,457 posts
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Post by LeoThunder on Oct 17, 2018 18:03:39 GMT
The sound you like in the SC-Custom will be given by the DC variant too (the SG copy). It will also have the short scale (628mm) but none of the other idiosyncrasies like the weight, neck angle, the thick, edgy body or the imbalance. Thanks so much for the info. I actually had not seen those (Angus Young fanboy here), so I'll check them right now. Be aware that some of the new SC-Custom models have a coil split function. This doesn't seem to have appeared on the DC-Custom yet.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 17, 2018 18:32:27 GMT
Hey hyke , one solution to a sticky glossy neck that many of us grab is to rub it down to a satin finish. Not down to the wood mind you, just a little fine wet and dry or wire wool is enough to take the shine off. It can make all the difference to the feel. I tried that on my SC-550 Amber flame and the poly is waaaay too thick to do anything with it but make it smell awful for months!!! If you dislike glossy necks get an all natural Pacifica/Ibanez style neck/guitar
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DefJef
THBC Moderator
Due to musical differences I've decided I can't work with myself any more.
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Post by DefJef on Oct 17, 2018 18:39:30 GMT
Hey hyke , one solution to a sticky glossy neck that many of us grab is to rub it down to a satin finish. Not down to the wood mind you, just a little fine wet and dry or wire wool is enough to take the shine off. It can make all the difference to the feel. I tried that on my SC-550 Amber flame and the poly is waaaay too thick to do anything with it but make it smell awful for months!!! If you dislike glossy necks get an all natural Pacifica/Ibanez style neck/guitar Yuck. Weird poly. Poly should have cured and be rock hard, some say too rock hard. You should be able to satinise the finish rather than rub through it. Just enough to alter the feel. That poly sounds like it must have come in a can from Halfords...still smarting from that disastrous respray>grumble>moan.
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hyke
Harley Benton Club Junior Member
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Post by hyke on Oct 20, 2018 15:47:44 GMT
Okay let's see. I've been reading and hearing this last 3 days. And as someone suggested, I took a look at the DC-Custom. I really like it tbh. More than the CST-24T. I've been listening to different videos and they sound a bit muddy to my taste, so I think I'll pass on the CST24. Now I'm mostly torn on the SC-Custom // DC-Custom. I really like the sound on both, maybe more than on the SC550 Amber Paradise (although the SC550 sounds great too) But, as some people pointed out, the SC-Custom has that weird neck angle, and because I've never tried a guitar with it, I'm sure that I can get used to it, but I don't know if I'll enjoy it. So I think that I'll be ordering the DC-Custom first, as it feels like a middle step between my crappy Strat and the SC-Custom. (it will happen sometime between next week - 1st Nov) And after having a feel at the shorter scale length n' stuff, If I like it, I'll try to order an SC-Custom sometime around January - March.
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